company and that might be something you have to do for free or for a short amount of time, at least to prove what you're doing to get through the front door and actually start to create data that can scale throughout the company and help selling what your idea is. >> and finally a lot of can companies start as sort of, you know, work by the seat of their pants. they pitch things. that's a good idea. they don't necessarily do formal presentations, formal business plans. when you go in to see someone at a big brand, do you need to make a formal power point, beautiful presentation, or can you just have a conversation? >> i think you need both. you need to be able to have a conversation on the fly, be open to brain storming, open to ideas. what you think your company might offer, might be something different than what the company thinks you might offer and, also, because this person is going to start to share your information throughout the organization, having a nice presentation or even having a video and seeing a lot of startups create videos for what their company does, is a great way to share what you're doing and help me or whoever it is you meet with sell throughout my own company. >> rachel, thanks so much for coming in.